The difference in results between Scandinavia and the rest of the EU is very interesting. A well-working educational system is clearly the best weapon against fascism.
Also, a well working social system with low corruption. But it’s a bit chicken and the egg sort of situation.
It’s really not that simple. Look at Austria, for example. It’s also a lot about culture and society itself and how it developed. We are exporting nazis ffs. Shit that gets people thrown out of parties in Germany (like Krah) is just another Tuesday in Austria. And we have a great educational system. Of course with ways to improve.
Austrian Nazis? now I’ve heard everything!
Krah wasn’t kicked out, they just didn’t want him to show up to events because of looks. Now that the election is over watch them fully embrace that treasonous, SS glorifying nazi back as their top candidate. Also I bet it will not take longer than two weeks until LePenne forgets that the AfD is more and more admiting to be fascist and welcomes them back to ID
You’re not up to date I guess. He will not be part of the Delegation. But he’s still a member of the AfD. (https://www.tagesschau.de/inland/krah-afd-europaparlament-fraktion-100.html)
You are right, I posted this before it hit the news that he was kicked out of the delegation. However, it wouldn’t surprise me if that changes again after the dust settles. He is still a party member, as you said.
Correct me if I’m wrong but wasn’t Krah just forbidden by his party to go campaigning (and he did campaign anyway)? As far as I know he’s still part of the AfD.
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It really depends, there’s plenty of ways to politicize an educational system and call it well-working. I think a more crucial distinction would be to teach people to be able to discern good sources from shit sources and how they can be manipulated without realizing it, and having taught across several semesters, if a good education system is simply not viable (i.e. poorer EU countries).
EU élections are often used to show your frustrations with the current government. In Sweden and Finland the current government is right wing.
Indeed it is. And still our right wing populists are constantly screeching how the “general media is clearly and unfairly left-biased,” and “how the other side of the story remains untold”.
No shit, Sherlock. Nearly all journalists have college or university degrees, that’s what happens when you open your mind to the larger world.
Participation in the EU election in Sweden was at a record low - just above 50%, which is amongst the worst in Europe. IMO that’s a serious warning flag.
That’s why the right hate universities. Well, that and the fact they unis will call out their BS.
A well-working educational system is clearly the best weapon against fascism.
That has never stopped fascism before. Ever.
I think they assume “well working” means “is not a propaganda tool for the fascists.”
They probably don’t want to acknowledge that capturing schools, and what history and literature they are allowed to teach, is also the easiest way to create the Hitler Youth.
It also rather demonstrates that they are the best way to create the Anti-Hitler Youth.
It also rather demonstrates that they are the best way to create the Anti-Hitler Youth.
As far as I’m aware, proper antifascism is not a subject taught at European schools. Today’s antifascists had to learn it the same way the interwar antifascists learned it - from scratch.
But it’s actually far, far worse than that. Liberal societies are utterly unwilling to confront what fascism really is nor the reasons fascism grows so easily in said liberal societies, and education cirriculums, of course, follow suit. This all makes it very easy for fascism to fester pretty much out in the open.
I won’t be relying on a formal education system to even slow fascism down… never mind stop it.
What is the proper anitfascism?
Definitely not the way the GDR did it. In the west it actually was simple, besides the obvious (teaching accurate history) boiling down to essentially Schopenhauer:
The cheapest sort of pride is national pride; for if a man is proud of his own nation, it argues that he has no qualities of his own of which he can be proud; otherwise he would not have recourse to those which he shares with so many millions of his fellowmen. The man who is endowed with important personal qualities will be only too ready to see clearly in what respects his own nation falls short, since their failings will be constantly before his eyes. But every miserable fool who has nothing at all of which he can be proud adopts, as a last resource, pride in the nation to which he belongs; he is ready and glad to defend all its faults and follies tooth and nail, thus reimbursing himself for his own inferiority.
And it works! Germans take much pride in their individual capacity to complain about the nation.
Let go of your earthly desires and become Buddha.
That, and also that’s not how the English language works.
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Fascism is always populated by ignorant morons. Always.
And the capitalists who funds fascism? Are they ignorant morons, too?
What about the media, which goes out of it’s way to downplay fascism? Are they morons as well?
What about the police, who always protects and enables fascism - what about them?
Your understanding of fascism is dangerously naive.
So goddamn sick of fascist populists. Fuck humanity, so fucking stupid it can’t help but shit the bed and fuck everyone else right along with em
Fascism doesn’t just come and go because people wax and wane in collective stupidity, it’s a very specific set of conditions including Class Colaborationism, rising nationalism, and declining material conditions causing people to long for “the good old days” and “take care of our own, the immigrants are stealing from us so we can’t.” The Class Colaborationism bit is important, because it explains why Social Democracies are especially vulnerable to fascism, as Social Democracy is also based on Class Colaborationism, just not based on nationalism and violent suppression.
People don’t randomly become fascist out of nowhere, it’s a failure to move forward and improve conditions that is being taken advantage of by bad actors to solidify power.
Yeah, free, happy and educated people don’t suddenly wake up as fascists one day.
No, they are conditioned to it by radical fascist talk radio and little betas like Charlie Kirk
Note that conditions haven’t been getting worse in America, but there’s a campaign by the populists to make people feel like it’s worse.
The economy is better than before the pandemic, the wages have finally started beating inflation (to the point people are making more now in wages than before the pandemic). But if you’re on social media you would not think this is the case.
Conditions have been getting worse. Capitalism requires this. Wealth disparity is skyrocketing, wages fail to keep up with productivity, and American Imperialism is causing genocide.
A minor uptick as compared to a couple years ago does not mean Capitalism is no longer declining.
Except the uptick is from 1990, it’s been getting better for about 34 years now, with setbacks in the dotcom crash, financial crisis and the pandemic.
There haven’t been better wages at any point in US history as we beat the uptick of the 1970s some time ago
Wages have been stagnating with respect to productivity, disparity is rising, home ownership is becoming more impossible for the average person, and the bulk of this decline is exported to the Global South which we brutally exploit for cheaper goods.
Home ownership rate has been steady for decades
The wages have been going up, just not exactly as fast productivity for several reasons:
That certainly doesn’t look steady, lol. Large investment firms and banks are buying up a large number of single family housing, making it unaffordable.
Wages do go up, yes, with respect to inflation. They get nowhere close to productivity increases, as exploitation rises.
Your post describes exactly the state I’m in. Fuck all these greedy fucks, fuck the dumb shits that vote them, fuck the conservatives enabling these Nazi fucks.
So goddamn sick of fascist populists
They’re the only ones allowed to do any populism. Ratchet keeps tightening, because centrists refuse to do anything nice for people and leftists who obtain the power to do so get labeled “tankie” and run out of office.
So of course, the only people allowed to say anything with a baseline public appeal are going to win a fucking popularity contest
“Tankie” “Socialist” “Communist” the same things thrown at any politicians left of center.
And a few right-of-center, when you look at how DLC Dems like Biden and Clinton got smeared.
Lmfao true
Socialist and Communist, sure. But what politicians have been called tankies? I thought tankies were a specific type of communist.
Yeah tankies are just authoritarian apologists specifically for Stalin and Mao types
I’ve seen like 20 different interpretations of “tankie” on lemmy since moving over here from reddit last year, never heard it before that and I’m a pretty political person.
Tankies comes from the word tank obv. More specifically it comes from the tanks the soviets and China used to suppress popular uprisings. People who support these regimes and these actions or try to minimize their terror are tankies.
Tankie is definitely a newer term that hasn’t hit the mainstream zeitgeist, I already see it thrown around on lemmy like how conservatives call everything “woke”, just a matter of time imo.
To clarify, the other two are usually right wing smears, tankie appears to be a left wing smear to those further left. I know the idea behind it is fake leftists who are actually just Authoritarions but… Still lol that’s how it goes with labels a lot of the time, especially the more niche it is
Tankie has been a pretty common phrase at least since I was in college. I thought they were the folks who carried water for authoritians like Mao and Stalin. It’s more specific than ‘woke’ or even ‘liberal’, in my experience it’s more akin to calling someone maga or antivax; it confers specific positions. I’ve had friends who proudly identified with the term. Unless it’s changed in meaning recently and I didn’t get the memo.
I see it thrown around on lemmy a LOT, just like how woke gets thrown around by the right, I’m not saying it doesn’t have an actual “true” meaning, just that (like most labels as I mentioned and particularly those that are more specific/niche initially) it eventually gets bastardized and thrown around with the original specific meaning lost.
That’s because there are a LOT of tankies on lemmy, specifically lemmy.ml. In many threads anything slightly critical of Russia or China will get deleted and the users banned. It may have other meanings but that’s what it means here: people carrying water for authoritarian regimes while LARPing as leftists.
We, all of us, from all the places, need to get together and start our own county. I’d bring the liquor, though our friends from Germany may legitimately throw me out a window so I’ll leave that to them.
In all seriousness, this is a situation where the minority are the loudest. Everywhere. In the U.S., Canada, South America, Europe and all the States within, we all want a better life. Do what those of us in the U.S. haven’t been able to do and organize if you haven’t. Despite the dumbasses over here flinging insults and threats, many of us are also hoping for the best across the old pond.
This situation with rising fascism is a world problem. It’d be awesome if we could, as a larger community, come together in stalwart support against something, and not just in support of each other.
Whatever you do just know we’re fighting over here in the U.S. too. Many of us are so sick of being robbed to repeat the mistakes of the past.
Anyway, this turned into a rant. I apologize.
With liquor I think you’d be fine. It’s beer that I have found Germans to be picky about. They will find a window to throw you out of if you hand them a Bud Light
Bud Light
AKA Pisswasser.
That is so not true! My German office mate from way back would drink ANY beer. And he was super fun. As a matter of fact, one time he brought Bud Light to a party I threw. He had issues with green peppers, though. Used to say, “Did you know that green peppers are just unripened red peppers?” I don’t think that’s a German thing. I think it was a him thing.
This could work. We could maybe take over Andorra or Monaco. They wouldn’t mind because we will seduce them by being either A) shopaholics in Andorra or B) gambling addicts in Monaco. It could be like this big European Vacation that never ends (eat your hearts out, Griswalds).
You’re aware that Monaco is a full-blown monarchy, are you. Yes there’s a parliament but every law needs the signature of the Prince, who is also sole head of the executive. Also they already have like 80% foreign population in the city.
San Marino would be the sane choice. Sole country ever to first elect fascists (to avoid getting invaded by Mussolini), then elect MLs, and then get rid of them again in the next elections. (Had no chance to get rid of the fascists like that they went AWOL after Mussolini’s death). Oldest constitutional republic in the world. Arguably the oldest democracy in the world: Modern suffrage was introduced in 1906 by the Arengo, a meeting of all household heads, which had had constitutional primacy since the middle ages it simply never got around giving the ruling oligarch council the boot. That council was first introduced in 1243 because the Arengo became unwieldy, then centralised power, then forgot who gave it power. I mean after 650 years that’s not necessarily surprising.
I said take it over, not obey the monarchy. The comment I’m replying to suggests creating our own country that is free of fascism. I proposed these two places because they are small and easy to take over peacefully by means of shopping and gambling. Ever hear of passive territorial expansion? That was my idea. You don’t seem to indicate another place for us to go to that would be better, geographically speaking. Maybe an island? Maybe Ibiza? That would be cool. I wonder if you were a boring child. No imagination. I also wonder if you didn’t understand my comment. I was like suggesting territorial takeover. Last time I looked, pretty much the entire European continent is occupied. Forming a new nation within Europe involves taking over a place. I picked a couple of small, easy to take over places with shopping, drinking and or gambling. And all of this is just silly, anyway. Reality must strike. This lovely plan ain’t happening. The future is quite bleak.
If you want to take over Monaco by force you’ll have to deal with France. Essentially, because history, France tolerates a part of itself as a privately-owned municipality with a symbolic UN seat of its own. Similar things apply to Andorra though there it’s both France and Spain, also they’re more democratic but you’d still have a tough time with all that Catholicism there. Ibiza is part of Catalonia, ask the Catalans overall how easy it is to gain independence from Spain. Liechtenstein is also out, they actually gave their prince absolute power in a referendum. Hopeless case. By force, you’d soon discover that the mountains say “Grüezi”. Vatican state, forget it.
There’s a reason I mentioned San Marino.
OK, so we’ll all go to San Marino. I was basically throwing out some ideas. It’s a brainstorm, not a contest. San Marino is kind of dear to my heart, anyway, because of reasons you mentioned, which I know well. Also: we need to do it now, because later we’ll all be starved to death in concentration camps.
Also, I did not mention force. I very much expressed my desire to take anything over passively. Andorra, shopping. Monaco, gambling. No military. Just sphere of influence influencing and boom, over time, we got them taken over gradually and peacefully.
Can’t we take over a section of Asia and then pretend Europe ends all the way over there? I feel like people do that all the time. Hell, Australia is in Eurovision.
I am 100% on board with this. I mean, Israel even gets to be on Eurovision, or anybody that wants to join Eurovision. Eurovision proves that we continentals are really flexible when it comes to the Eurovision. I’m just on board with the original comment about bringing the liquor and making our own country. I’m just so wondering where can we go? I want to be on board. Should we create a mailing list? I want to be on my own and happy, drinking with my fellow left-wing Europeans who are ready and willing to just be free and happy and not worry about what we have to say in public about people. Like, for example, I’m from Spain. Vox is mentally retarded and nostalgic for Franco and people like them here. What the hell? Fucking Spain has been free from Franco for like over 40 years, and I have to mingle with stupid assholes that are nostalgic for him? No thank you. I’d much prefer live in another country. That I made myself with people who are not nostalgic for fascism. You’d think people might learn some shit from history or whatever the fuck. They don’t seem to. Some of them get all nostalgic for Franco. Fuck my life.
